“I take it the club pay yearly so members can fish Doe park?

If that is the case why do the club have the fund any of the work that is needed?”

Posted by Mark - Webmaster | 16/11/2009 15:55:36

“Hi

The club funding Yorks Water repairs :-0 , I think not !!! I pay enough to them already thank you. It's not Our water it's YW's and they should fund the repairs. I would rather see the fishing dumped and the money spent on acquiring another venue or spent improving existing waters.

Phil”

Posted by Phil | 16/11/2009 19:47:55

“I tend to agree with the above comments, YW should first be refunding any outstanding rent for the loss of the venue and IF they want to rent it out again, then surely it is their responsibility as Landlords/Landowners to carry out any necessary repairs. IF the club stump up money to help with the repairs, then the reduction in rent should more than equal the money put in, e.g. for every £100 put in, rent reduction of £130.
I can see how many members will be keen to keep the venue, so in the end the decision must be from the members if it involves expense to the club. Hopefully the venue can be kept without any extra expense for the club.”

Posted by Dave Abbott | 17/11/2009 17:41:46

“Hi everyone - thanks for those comments. It's a difficult call. Yes the club pays so that its members can fish Doe Park (and we have done for more than 70 years now). Yes, Yorks Water should pay for repairs to its reservoirs. Yes, we could dump the fishing, but that would penalise for ever those members who fish Doe Park. It would also lose BCAA one of its three still-water venues, and the one closest to central Bradford. So it seems a no-brainer for us to try and keep the fishing at Doe Park by whatever means likely to succeed.
So why doesn't YW pay for the repairs? - well, we're told that it will take a long time for YW to find the money (even though it's not very much) and therefore - even if repairs are made - it's unlikely we'll get the fishing back soon. Even if repairs are made, there's no guarantee they'll come back to us - so there is a reasonable case to be made for BCAA to fund some of the repairs, to get the fishing back more quickly - and for BCAA to stake its claim. And of course we wouldn't offer to fund repairs unless some 'good value' return (reduced rental, getting fishing rights back again) was guaranteed.
Dave Abbott is quite right when he says that the decision must be made by members, if keeping the fishing means expense to the club. But don't forget that the Committee makes decisions on running the club on behalf of its members (and it's so difficult to get Committee members!) - but can only do what most members want if most members tell them. At present, we have only three or four views out of the 1000+ membership. So what do other members want the Committee to do in respect of Doe Park? Please let us know your views, so that we can make a decision informed by what members think!!!
Cheers Jim”

Posted by Jim - MemSec | 17/11/2009 22:46:51

“For me the club should do everything it can to keep the fishing rights. It sounds to me if the club doesn't part-fund the repairs Yorkshire Water will probably close access to the banks permanently.
If we can negotiate, why does access to the field side need to be closed? It can only now be accessed using the public footpaths through neighbiuring fields. This could be a sign-posted requirement. Maybe we could pay a reduced rent until the banks are repaired, or it could be a goodwill gesture on Yorkshire Water's part whilst the work is being negotiated and completed. Doe Park is THE reason for my membership!”

Posted by Richard Midgley | 10/12/2009 15:46:16

““Hi Richard
The committee is quite clear that we want to get back the Doe Park fishing rights. We are quite clear that a considerable number of people are members of the club BECAUSE of Doe Park. We don't want to lose this water, and trhe Membership and funds it represents.
You're right - repair of the banks is not YW's main priority and the fear is that they will close the water to angling permanently. But they have (at our request) asked a contractor to look at what needs to be done and to provide a quote for that - I can't comment on how robust that request is in terms of specifications for the work and the required speed of response, but at least something is happening. Ideally, I'd like the club to be able to project-manage the repairs from start to finish, but unfortunately that's in the hands of YW. And if we pester them too much, to try and speed things up, we risk losing the fishing forever.
At the moment, YW say that the banking is too dangerous to allow angling. Of course, some banks are not dangerous, but with free access all the way round, people can access the dangerous parts - so YW have to close all fishing (though word on the grapevine is that some still are angling there) fort heir own corporate responsibility reasons. It's not a case of negotiating access to the field side only, I fear - but we could ask the question, I guess. And that would have to come with reduced rent rates.
I'll post a summary of the current position on this discussion thread shortly, following the Committee meeting last night.
Cheers
Jim
””

Posted by Jim - MemSec | 11/12/2009 08:45:06

“SITUATION UPDATE RE DOE PARK 11DEC2009
At its meeting last night, the BCAA Committee discussed its
correspondence with Yorkshire Water (YWS) about Doe Park. The Club has
asked YW to provide detailed costs for all required repairs to the
banking. YWS have confirmed that they have requested a contractor to
look at the repairs needed and to provide a quotation for the work. No
specification of the works required or a deadline for the contractor's
response has been set.
Pending any news from YWS over the Xmas period, this matter will be
further discussed at the next Committee meeting, on 14 January.
”

Posted by Jim (MemSec) | 13/12/2009 16:43:11

“Any more news yet?”

Posted by David Sunderland | 05/03/2010 19:23:46

“Hi David
Yes, I've been a bit remiss posting updates. Mainly because there's nothing new to tell. The January Committee meeting was too soon after New Year for us to have had any fruitful discussion with Yorkshire Water. I wasn't at the Feb Committee meeting (I was committed to meeting my daughter's GCSE teachers at school) - but understand there was no discussion of Doe Park.
We have a Committee meeting on Thursday - Doe Park was already on my agenda and I will be raising it as a topic for discussion, beleive me! It's the closest water we have to Bradford - and we need to get the fishing back if at all possible, for the sake of our members.
Cheers
Jim”

Posted by Jim Munden (MemSec) | 07/03/2010 17:53:04

“Hi
Just wondering if anybody had any updates on Doe Park, Its been 7 weeks since any updates have been posted. I'm keen to get back on there as currently i am having to fish Staveley, which i dont mind, but its a 60 mile round trip away from where i live! And Shiptons even further. There both a bit far to be travelling when i go fishing 3 times a week”

Posted by Dean | 25/04/2010 19:47:41

“Hi there
Latest situation about Doe Park.
At the last Committee meeting on 8 April we were still awaiting a reply from Yorkshire water to the query we posed to them at the end of February about the fishing at Doe Park.
We had a reply ten days ago from the 'Rural Team' which told us that Yorkshire Water (YWS) have still not received a quote to fix the bankings as the water will need to be drawn down for this. Internal discussion with YWS Operations as to when this might be reveals that there are currently no plans to draw the reservoir down soon.
We are told that YWS feel that it is more of a priority to keep the club off the reservoir
whilst it is in the current (dangerous) condition and not a priority to have a fishing
club on the reservoir. As soon as YWS are able to obtain a quotation for
the repairs YWS will get in touch with Bradford City Angling Association.
It's not very helpful, I'm afraid, but that's all we know at the moment.
Cheers, Jim
”

Posted by Jim Munden (MemSec) | 25/04/2010 20:16:52

“With Doe Park and the rivers being out of use it seriously highlights the clubs lack of still waters, we lost Leeming a few years back, which was never replaced and now we're losing Doe Park. I think its time that the club started looking into new still waters, the price of the year book goes up every year but the amount of waters is slowly going down. If Doe Park is still out of action, or the possibility of some new still waters added to the club by the time renewal is due, i will be seriously considering my 20 years membership, i don't want to because i like Staveley and Doe Park, but you've got to ask if the year book is worth its price anymore. This seems to be a popular opinion amongst a few fellow anglers i have spoken to, Anglers who have this year got new memberships with other angling clubs because of the lack of still waters with City. There are other Bradford Angling clubs with 13 still waters, 2 just isnt enough”

Posted by Dean | 25/04/2010 22:40:58

“Hi Dean It's quite true that permanent loss of Doe Park (and it doesn't look too hopeful at the moment) is a serious blow for those anglers who want to fish still waters. Staveley and Shipton are good, but only go so far since they're a long way from Bradford - and Doe Park was the stillwater most on the Bradford doorstep.

You should be aware that the club has been looking for still waters to replace Leeming and Doe Park, but it's not been an easy task and opportunities have been few and far between. There was a stillwater near Knaresborough which cam up for auction earlier this year - that went (I believe) for £130,000. Not for fishing but for another commercial development. Then there was a reservoir up past Skipton, which was recently available for lease. It was a long way out, BCAA expressed interest, but it went to Settle Anglers instead. There was a third one - three lakes being given up by the owner (I'm hazy about where they were without reference to Mike Briggs) - but the farmer wasn't interested in elasing them for angling and intends to fill them in instead. There have been others over the years .... so we are trying to fill those gaps in our list of waters. But it's not easy, especially when there's so much competition for still waters which inflates the price.

If any member can identify waters which are coming up for lease, or up for sale, the Committee would be very glad to hear of these, so that we can put out feelers. There's money in the bank and a real willingness to take on a new stillwater - I suppose we might even consider sharing a water if we can find another club who is willing to do so. I've just one exception to make with you Dean - you say the Yearbook keeps going up in price each year. I can't agree with you there, because the general membership rate has not moved for nearly 10 years - though I will be asking for a small increase of about £2 at the next AGM, probably to take effect in 2012. if you know of any waters becoming available, please let anyone on the General Committee know soonest. thanks Jim”

Posted by Jim Munden (memSec) | 26/04/2010 07:50:16

“Is it in any way possible for BCAA to get its own survey of thwe water done so that we have some real idea of what repairs might be likely to cost? Is there any possibility of forming a group from the membership with the necessary expertise to do this? Surely we have some contractors in the membership who for the good of the club would at least donate the time to take a look at the whole setup and make some sensible recommendations, even if it involves something as simple as some fencing off of the dangerous areas so that at least some fishing can go on? Just a thought, but it has worked for other clubs in similar situations. I've done some work in the past with a landscaper on reconstituting dammed lakes (repairing sluices, bank repair and so forth) and would be pleased to be involved, but I have no experience in estimating costs for such work having always sub-contracted for the waterbased parts of such projects where the primary contractor has seen to that side of things.”

Posted by David Henderson | 26/04/2010 09:44:01

“Hi David
Thanks for those suggestions and for your offer of help. My personal; view is that it’s not an easy problem to solve – small fishing club, not really business oriented or with the power of PR behind us, against a large supplier (YWS) will little profit-motive to help us.

It’s clear that getting a quick cost estimate and repair from YWS is likely to be a difficult and long drawn-out process because:
1) YWS put low priority to leasing the fishing off
2) they’re a profit-making company, so I guess they’ll be looking for a good cost-benefit return on any investments they make (and fishing probably won’t give them that)
3) repairs to YWS properties are (I think) only undertaken by YWS-approved contractors
4) YWS tell us that they need the water to be at a low level so that they can assess properly the repairs required (so that they can accurately specify an offer for tender, I guess) and do not know when draw-off is likely.

So how do we reduce these barriers? We could:
1) raise YWS priority by pestering them or persuading them until they do something – though that might compromise our ever getting the water back if we’re not careful
2) pay for the repairs ourselves, or fence off the dangerous part as you suggest
3) talk direct to the YWS contractor (with YWS permission of course) or find another one acceptable to YWS
4) do very little but keep a very close eye on the water level and make sure the contractor is called in if it does, in a dry summer for example …..

We really do need to get into a proper business discussion with YWS, if we can, and they are willing …….
Cheers
Jim
”

Posted by Jim Munden (MemSec) | 26/04/2010 13:46:03

“Its nice to know that the club are looking into new still waters. Maybe i'm totally wrong here, but did Doe Park used to be stocked by the club years ago? What are the laws regarding the removal of fish from Doe Park into another venue. By that i mean go to Yorkshire water and say we stocked it years ago, your not letting us fish it, we're going to remove the fish and put them into either a new ready made venue, or see if we could get some land and create a venue ourselves. I have fished Doe Park for many years and know there are many many fish in there, easy enough to stock 2/3 venues the size of Staveley (Small Lake). Its just an idea, but if Yorkshire water arn't letting us fish it, and nobody else is goin to fish it, maybe they'd have little objection to us removing them...”

Posted by Dean | 26/04/2010 17:04:51